Episode 119: No Longer Last on the List with Jo Bevilacqua
/The past few weeks have been a brutal reminder for me that prioritizing my own health and well-being is absolutely critical, not only for parenting and partnering consciously, but just for living a purposeful, meaningful life! So often when self-care is taught to parents, especially moms, we get "sold" on it by highlighting the benefits of taking good, gentle care of yourself for your family:
You'll be able to be a better parent!
It will be easier to stay calm and well-regulated!
You'll be able to enjoy your kids more!
Your kids & partner will feel more loved and connected if you're able to be fully present, and self-care can help with that!
The list goes on. But very rarely do we just come out and say it: you would be worthy of rest, nourishment, and gentle care even if you weren't a parent and even if it did nothing to help you be better for others. You're worthy because you are living. Because you're a person with human needs. You don't have to earn it, and it's ok if something is just for you.
That's what this week's episode is all about! I am joined by my new colleague, Jo Bevilacqua, author of No Longer Last On The List and its for women who are juggling the pressure of life and expectations.
She will help us learn how to:
Set boundaries with friends and family
Embrace our worth
Say no without feeling guilty
Make more time for ourselves
If you want to read her book you can get it HERE. Be sure to follow Jo on Facebook and Instagram!
TRANSCRIPT
Parenting is often lived in the extremes. It's either great joy or chaotic, overwhelmed. In one moment, you're nailing it and the next you're losing your cool. I want to help you find your way to the messy middle, to a place of balance. You see balance is a verb, not a state of being. It is a thing you do. Not a thing you are. It is an action, a process, a series of micro corrections that you make each and every day to keep yourself feeling centered. We are never truly balanced. We are engaged in the process of balancing.
Hello, I'm Dr. Laura Froyen and this is The Balanced Parent Podcast where overwhelmed, stressed out and disconnected parents go to find tools, mindset shifts and practices to help them stop yelling at the people they love and start connecting on a deeper level. All delivered with heaping doses of grace and compassion. Join me in conversations that will help you get clear on your goals and values and start showing up in your parenting, your relationships, your life with openhearted authenticity and balance. Let's go!
Laura: Hello, everybody. This is Dr. Laura Froyen, and on this episode of The Balance Parent Podcast, we're going to be talking about how critical it is for parents and especially Moms, to stop putting ourselves last on the list and how we can use boundaries, healthy boundaries to achieve that goal. And to help me with this conversation, we're going to be talking with new friend and colleague, Jo, and she's going to introduce ourselves. So, Jo, welcome to the show. Tell us a little bit more about who you are and what you do.
Jo: Hi. Thanks for having me. I'm so excited to be here, so I'm, I am a multi business owner. So I'm over in England and we have multiple businesses here, bricks and mortar businesses. So we have a flowing business. We have a health and beauty salon with a crash, and I have a mentoring business too. And then last year, I decided to become an author
Laura: Because we didn't have enough to do.
Jo: So kids partner with a dog.
Laura: So, yeah, to add something else to my to do list.
Laura: And tell us a little bit about your book. No longer last on the list.
Jo: Yeah, So I decided that this book was something that was in me for quite a few years. I'm such a girl's girl. I have lots of different groups of friends. All at different stages in their life, careers, family and the same conversations are coming up time and time again, boundaries being one of them. And during the pandemic, two of my businesses temporarily shut down. My mental business went really busy and really crazy.
But again, everything that I was hearing pandemic I was hearing. But it was heightened. So women were definitely putting themselves last on the list, if at all, on the list, and everything. And everyone seemed to come above the wants and needs of the women that I really the friends with, I was working with or I was having conversations with. So I definitely felt like this was the time to put pen to paper, and to write all the things that I've learned over the years, and I am by no means perfect. I definitely follow my advice more time.
But I feel like there was something that was needed for parents and adults and women, especially with lots of responsibility you go to and to feel like they were seeing and they were hard and they were understood, but not only read through it, but actually have been useful activities and tools that we're gonna help them to make themselves more of a priority. And I definitely feel like during covid. And now, even though we're kind of still in it, women are continuously putting themselves on the list.
So I just feel like it's a great tool for women to read and to use and to share and to spark conversations that the world is not perfect. No one else as well. That's perfect. There's a lot of parents out there where you feel like everyone else has got his shit together. And we were the only ones that difficult juggling all these millions place that we have. So that was the premise of me writing the book, and I can't believe that it's nearly been out a year already.
So I love talking about it. I love having these conversations, and I feel like it's something is women that we need to do more of. We need to open up our hearts and our conversations and admit have difficult things can be or how much pressure. We feel on a day to day basis and if this book sparks that conversation then amazing.
Laura: Yeah, I think it's a really important thing to be considering. So the research that's coming out on families right now is that the moms of children who are school-age have been terribly impacted by this pandemic.
And so I think that your, I've seen exactly what you were witnessing, that all of the things that made motherhood in particular really difficult before the pandemic. We're only heightened, especially because once the kids came home, we were all home. There is so much additional load placed on mothers and at the same time all of our outlets, all of our opportunities for self-care were stripped away at the exact same time.
So we had extra load and fewer outlets. I think it's been really, really hard on parents all across this beautiful world, so it's good to know that other people are seeing this. I think that the research is showing this, and I think that all of our listeners are listening right now, are probably raising their hands and saying, Yes, that's me. That's been my experience, too. I think it's been really hard for all of us. And so I guess I'm kind of curious about your in this place. You realize, Okay, this big load has been on me. It's continuing to be on me.
We're you know, we're looking ahead in this pandemic. There have been times where we thought, Oh, it's coming to an end and then, you know it's not and it's closing down again, and it seems like that cyclical nature is going to be here for a while. I think we need to get prepared for it to be here for a little bit of a of time.
And so, in this new kind of reality that were in as parents, what can we be doing? Especially us moms, as both of us are. What can we be doing to lessen the negative impact this is having on us and get ourselves on the list, let alone closer to the top?
Jo: Yeah, so the first thing we do, I think it's such a good point. There's so many things that pandemic we would normally do, so we would go out for coffee with girlfriends or for dinner, or we'd go and have a blow out and have some drinks and have a dance.
Laura: Or go to a yoga class. Yes, yeah, I used to be able to go to dance classes for a few nights a week, and I can go to my dance classes on Zoom I can. It's not the same as being in a room field of I went to a body positive dance studio. So being in a room full of like, beautiful curvaceous women who are embodied and enjoy full movement like it's not the same as doing that in your living room. And it's just not.
Jo: The conversations different. There has been a great substitute for a while, but yeah, the conversations that you have in passing when you get your guard down a little bit, there's just such a deeper level, and I feel like that's what we've been missing is that deep connection with ourselves and each other, and with people that are outside of our immediate family?
I'm just a space offload because being an adult is hard. Being a parent is hard. Being an employee or a business owner is hard life. That's a little bit more than that. So how can we change the narrative, and how can we bring some fun back? How can we take control of our surroundings when things feel so out of our control at the moment? And there's various different things and different ways in which we can do that. The first activity that we do in the book is asking everybody to write a list of priorities kind of 1 to 10, 1 to 20.
But I don't think too much about it just left down what comes into your head. And by doing that, so many people were literally putting themselves last on the list or not on the list at all, which is even more worrying. So it's about looking at what you think is a priority and maybe just thinking about how can we readjust this?
How can we slowly move our way up on the list of priorities? Because in an ideal world we're going from the bottom. We would go straight to the top, but life is life, responsibilities, responsibilities, and we have to be a bit real about it. So how can we move ourselves slowly from position? Tend to position nine to position eight to make sure that by three months or six months or a year, we're back at the top and we are putting ourselves. So what does it look like?
Laura: Yeah, I was just gonna say to like, it doesn't have to be all or nothing, too. I think that we get stuck in this place as humans because humans are prone to black and white thinking. That's just the way our brains work. We get stuck in thinking like, okay, you know, either I do nothing for myself or I go on and do all the self-care things and we go in and we do all the self-care things, and then we're burned out from that, too.
And so I think it's really important to bring a little like a piece of balance to this, that there are times in places for you to be further down on your list. Your kids are sick. Your partner's got a big presentation at work that they're stressed about. There's times where we do like it's just the reality for parents. We do have to go further down, but it doesn't have to be all the time. There are times where we can say, sweetheart, I know you want to play with me right now and I love playing dinosaurs with you and right now I'm reading.
Right now. I'm generally and I'll be with you in 10 minutes to go ahead and set a timer and I'll be right there in 10 minutes and I'm going to finish my journal like it's okay. There's room for balance in this. I think we're tempted to do all in or it's like this all or nothing thing. And there's a space and time for move up and down through the list in various positions throughout the course of your day and week. I don't know.
Jo: Yeah, I think change is hard right with the program to our routines and our expectations and other people's opinions and our feelings and making changes can feel really difficult. But if you make a small changes, then that's brilliant. So, actually do you have a normal five minute shower because that's all you have time for.
But you are craving a bath with candles and nice millions of bathrooms and do that card at the time. But to do that you need to be really clear on what it is that makes you happy. You have to be really clear on what is gonna make you feel. And this is my favorite saying itself full. Every time I say to the moment, you can do this so you can do that. Or you can change this so you can change that.
But I would feel so selfish. Selfish has such a negative connotation at a negative attachment to that word. So actually, what if we just switch to that a little bit and say they're not being selfish for being self full? And the happier you are in the more self full, you are happier. Everybody is around you. I know that when I'm arguing with my kids or I have a connection with my husband is because I'm not helpful. I feel like there's something missing. Then I become a little bit more. You have a word in a G.
I don't know whether you guys, it's like, more agitated, so handy, and my temporary short term and things bother me. That wouldn't normally bother me. So I need to just take a step back and think, Okay, what am I doing or not doing for myself at this moment in time and how can I change that? It's all about what we can control. There's so many things in this world that we can't control. But actually, let's look at our environment.
Let's look at our emotions. That's how we reacting to things. Look at what we're doing for ourselves. Let's look at all the things we're doing for other people. And let's start doing more of what makes us still happy rather than thinking about everybody else all of the time, because that's when we become happy that we become more fulfilled. That's only feel like actually, we've got this.
Everything seems a little bit easier and doesn't seem a stressful. And boundaries is something that's really important to that. When you allow people to continue asking you for things or asking you for time or asking you for your attention and you allow them, the more they're going to do it. So we just need to start learning how to say no, no, again, it's not a negative one, which is another word in the dictionary we can use that and know is a full answer.
We don't need to explain ourselves no, is the answer, not right now, I can't quite manage that. What can you do to take responsibility? What can you do to make what you want to happen? So it's just about sometimes with having to perspective and make sure that other people are taking ownership over what they want and what they need, because we don't have the answers for everything and everyone as much as we feel that we are super women or that we have to be super women, that really isn't a realistic expectation that we put on ourselves.
Laura: So I agree. And I think that when we take on that super women persona that when we really we are attempting and trying to do all the things and the all the things to all the people, not only do we sometimes things fall through the cracks, we're not taking care of ourselves. Things don't get done as well as they could be.
But we're also this piece of learned helplessness that also comes as a part of that where we are training those around us to rely on us and not do for themselves. And we're robbing them of opportunities for their own creativity and their own resourcefulness, too. So I mean, I think that there's this piece of like, yes, it's nice to feel like we can do it all, but it's not truly sustainable or not fully serving us or anyone else.
Jo: We talk about this in the book a lot, and I think I feel the wanting to feel needed. Are you good?
Laura: Oh, yeah.
Jo: With our… Oh, my goodness, they need me.
Laura: I'm so important. But this is how we socialize girls to write. This is this is what we are culturally trained that our value and worth is wrapped up in how we serve others.
Jo: Absolutely. So are you a good girl? Because you've done this for somebody out we don't want to share. That's really selfish, you know, to helping this past them out. Really? That's a little bit me. Okay, so we get so much.
Laura: But this is why boundaries are hard, especially for women, because we've been trained our whole lives not to have any that we've been trained our whole lives that we don't get any. And when we try to have some, that was a bad person because of it, that it makes us a bad person, a bad girl a bad woman. So it's really freaking hard than to go and do it. And I think it's easy for us to say It sounds like you've had some practice with boundaries.
I've had a lot of practice learning to set boundaries, but I think it's really easy for us to say like no, it's a complete sentence and much harder to actually put in to action for a person who hasn't had the opportunity to work with boundaries for a little while. So I mean, I started setting boundaries with my dad and big explosive ways and I was like 13. Those also weren't super healthy boundaries.
But I started practicing with that because I knew that there was some unhealthy investment. You know, his ego was wrapped up in my school performance or something like that. You know, I could tell that there was some not healthy stuff going on and so I started practicing with that earlier. But there's lots of other things I had to learn. It takes time.
So for those of us who are new to setting boundaries, you know we need to have them, but it fills us with fear, like terror and fear of rejection. That's the first step, you know, if we're not quite yet at the like the no, it's a complete sentence stage. How do we get there?
Jo: Yeah, just that resonate with this is hilarious. So funny how it all goes through different experiences in life, that certain things. I think we all feel like we've gone through as women for sure. And I would say that setting boundaries just like a muscle more you do it. The better you get at, the bigger it becomes more important than more confident you become was saying it.
So I absolutely agree that should you go out tomorrow and start saying no to everything and everyone, that's probably not going to be so hopefully you're gonna be like I ended up here, Jo said. And Laura that everything. But it is definitely, um so I think start small when somebody asked something of you. And you know, when you just get that feeling in your data, listen to your gut. That's definitely something I have to work on A lot over the last few years is you're not being paranoid or not being evasive sensitive.
You're not being a bit like none of those things are gonna happen if you say no, that's not who you are. So it's about just listening to you get something, doesn't feel right. If you don't want to do something, then don't feel pressured into doing it. And there's loads of different Come back in which you can say, Okay, thank you for asking me. I feel really honored, but actually, I can't do that right now. I can't get that in my schedule right now. I don't think I'm the right person for that right now. Actually, I feel like you can do a great job that there's so many ways that you can slip up saying no, while you get in the practice of just saying.
Laura: I think so, too. And I think it's also, like, always okay to ask for time to someone asked you to do something to say like, I'm gonna need a couple of days to see if I can make that work, and then you can come back and say no later. When you've had a chance to practice your response and your delivery.
You can always ask for time to make a decision, and you can even be overt with people. You know, I'm trying to get better at making sure that I only say yes to the things that are really aligned that I know I can put my full energy to. So I'm going to take a little bit of time to make sure that this is a yes for me before I say yes to it.
Jo: And that's just because I'm not going to say, Of course I'll do that. How it is, that's just I think enough. Like you say, We've been trying to just step in and look cues and how you can help people. It just naturally, like I've done it before. It doesn't actually comes out of my mouth, and as soon as I can see why did I just want to make other people happy to help people out? But time? I think it's really important to give yourself that moment or an hour or a day. I don't rush into making decisions
Laura: And you can go back. So if you said that automatic, yes and you get home and your intuition is talking to you, that's what like listening to your gut means is that when you're getting that kind of spider since that little tinkle and you've got sick contraction, like feeling that feeling like, why did I say yes to that?
It's okay to circle back and say, you know, I was kind of caught off guard in the moment, and I've had a chance to think about it. And I really don't have space or capacity right now to take an additional thing on, I'm gonna have to say no to you. It's okay to circle back to those things. And people don't have to like it either they don't.
Jo: But today what people understand, we think they gonna hate us. They're gonna think we're horrible or that we're not helpful. And they all these stories that we tell ourselves, But actually the times where I have to say no or circle battle. But actually, I think I could do it, but I don't have the capacity. Okay, Cool. I'll just get somebody else to do it. And I was like, Oh, my goodness. I've just expressing over there for, like, three days.
I really getting somebody else to do it. We're doing it themselves, so yeah, I think sometimes we just need to check out the stories we tell ourselves and just they actually, it's gonna be fine. No one's gonna die. No one's gonna be hard. No one's gonna fall out with me. Nobody's gonna hate me. It's fine. Boundaries are important. I think everyone should start also complimenting other people sitting down because sometimes we need the information that we completely fine. I understand that. Thank you for letting me know, because you're like and for me to do that for me when I say boundary,
Laura: I so agree. So I feel like it is it takes a lot of practice and work, and I feel like something that's coming out of this conversation that we're having right now, for me is that most of the work that goes into boundary setting is internal. It's in conversation with yourself. It's checking in. How does this align with me? How does this feel to me? Is this is this? I know How can I deliver this in a way that feels aligned in terms of the relationship that I have with this person who's making this request?
Jo: I agree, and that brings me to my next point, which is actually just stupid and do some work on who are my as the person. What are my values? What am I good at? What am I willing to allow other people to hope for me or gift to me? So I think working on yourself and who you are and what your core values are really important. So in times where I think that I'm gonna let that person down or I don't feel like a good friend, I actually come back and take a step back. And I go back to my piece of paper where I have written down Who am I, right? So you can do a really simple exercise.
And then you just put your name in the middle of a piece of paper and almost like a spider grass. Just like all the words that you think are amazing about yourself. What are the things that you really feel make you as a person? And when I do this for people, if I say right, all the bad things, they can write it down really quickly. If I get them to right, good things about themselves. They really struggled because again so being conditions that if we talk about ourselves. We're working or we're both full or we're not modest and it's not a good look. But actually, we should be excited by who we are.
We are also unique in our in different ways, so I would definitely heard your listeners to really take some time. Whether that's in the bathroom, in the bed, on the sofa and the car, wherever you are, just get out a piece of paper and really love on yourself. You remind yourself of all the things that make you a beautiful person that you are, and that could be your lawyer. Your fun. You're excitable, You are good friends. You are a wholesome person. You really care for other people. You really care for yourself.
You are worth it. All these things that you want to tell yourself, Remind yourself, do that visually and go back to it often, especially when you're feeling a bit of a wobble. When it comes to the boundaries, or if you're having a bad day, we need to be able to remind yourself what an amazing person you are. All the things that you've achieved and all the things that you learn and just amazing person that you are.
Laura: I love that. And you know, that sounds like a really good exercise for writing. Your own affirmations to affirmations are an interesting thing and mantras. I think that, it's we go like look for lists of them on Pinterest and on Google.
But I think it's always better to write them for ourselves. And I think that would be a great tool for writing your own affirmations. Like I am kind of curious being like that would feel really good for me to say about myself. But I didn't see that. I would never find that on a list of affirmations.
Jo: Other things we can do for boundaries is writing. This is something that I found really helpful for myself, and some of the women that I've worked with is just doing like a simple Twenty-Four seven calendar and almost drawing out what you're gonna say perfect in my speech bubbles because there is no perfect. But what would your perfect week look like? When will you get up? What will you do? Well, you do your thing in the morning when you do exercise where you just have a quiet cup of coffee and so far we go for a run Or do you want to get up and spend time with your kids and have breakfast and make them fresh pancakes? I don't know. I'm not at that stage.
Yeah, I love my too much. I'm like, give me everything. I mean in the morning. Like, what is your week Look like? What do you do? Where do you spend your time? What is it that you do if you're working? How many hours do you want to spend on that? Do you want to work three days for five days? Do you want to work in the things when the kids are in that, What do you want your week to look like? And then if somebody is trying to ask if you have something that again, it's another visual reminder.
This doesn't sit in with how I want my time to look my day or my week. So I'm not gonna be able to do that right now. And again, it's just another tool to give you the confirmation that what other people needing from you is not sitting right with what you want to do right now and having that visual tool. Really? How does a reminder to just put yourself in your name for.
Laura: Absolutely. Can you talk a little bit about, a little bit of a different piece of boundaries that I think parents, especially moms, run into around not necessarily things that were being asked to do but almost information that's coming in towards us?
Advice about how parents are child gifts that are wonderful and generous, but not in alignment with what we're trying to do in our home, because we're trying to have a more simple life, you know, what about those types of boundaries? Or perhaps interactions that loved ones well-meaning loved ones are having with their kids aren't really in alignment with our goals and priorities are for our kids. What about that aspect of boundaries? Because it's a little bit different than just not taking on a new role in Yeah,
Jo: So I feel like communication is something again that we all need to be more comfortable with you guys in America so much more open I feel than us, as the British were like.
Laura: We have a big British audience, though, so lots of folks who are listening or in the U. K in Ireland. So just so you know, people are here.
Jo: Yeah, it's almost like the whole A lift and just keep everything in or sweet things under the carpet.
Laura: Calm and carry on.
Jo: Yeah, whereas sometimes I feel that we can have better communication when things start to a little bit. And it's about talking about the little things sometimes that bother us rather than waiting for a big explosion. So what happens is all these little things and all these little niggles, other people's expectations and other people's opinions and again, speech bubbles, guidance and support that people have all these messages that we have thrown at us all the time by friends or family or colleagues of society, or tv or social media with throwing all these different kind of messages.
But it's about having clear communication with the people around us, and again it goes back to control the controllable. And what can we can? We can control it on T V, but we can control what we watch. We can't control it on social media, but we can control who follow. We can't control what they right in the magazines that we can control what magazines we buy.
Laura: Okay, so let's take this and apply it to interactions with loved ones. I'm thinking about an example with my mother-in-law. I can't control what clothes she buys for my kids, but I can control whether those close go in my kids drawers versus getting donated.
Jo: Yeah, exchange them. But I think it's about you know,
Laura: That she puts the tags off because she doesn't because she doesn't want me to be able to exchange them.
Jo: But I think it's about again, is how do we? Because people will always do what they feel is right and what makes them happy. So I feel like actually we need to have a question with ourselves. Is this such a big deal, or is it just my kids love the clothes? Or is it me that have a problem with the clothes or do I mean sometimes I get it looking at Okay, well, I wouldn't just my kids in that. Does that mean that it's not nice? Maybe not.
Laura: It's a volume like literally won't fit in the drawers issue. It's a volume issue, not a style. I mean, kids go to the media free school so they can't have any characters or immediate images on their clothing at school. So we generally just don't really want close that they can't wear. But no, it's not a quality or anything like that. It's just volume. And the kids have asked for no more closed because they feel overwhelmed because they're in charge of putting their own clothes away and they can't get close in the drawers. I mean, I think
Jo: I guess that it would be the whole communication thing, isn't it, like thank them for a donation? Um, so and I think as humans, we always want to feel validated. We always want to listen to you and hard appreciated, I think, especially when it comes to grandparents'. I've definitely noticed that with my own parents and their relationships with my kids. But I guess it's about again having those communication lines and opening up that were really thankful. And we really appreciate the time that you spend going to get all of these clothes. But actually, at the moment the kids don't need any more is causing a bit of problems in this.
So actually, rather than buying them more clothes, which they probably won't wear and you're going to waste your money. Why don't you think about actually doing something like getting them a day voucher to do something fun with the kids instead or or buy them something, that they're going to help them with the education or have more fun or create memories?
That's definitely the way that we've gone down with our friends and because, I mean, we have a family. I cannot tell you the amount of family members and again we would get lots of presents that the kids might look at, but actually not time to play with that. We just have to have a really honest conversations, and they actually what's happening is they're getting so much stuff that they're not being able to play with it and or things are getting broken or things are not being used.
So actually, what we're trying to do more of a family is go to the cinema more so cinema. But that would be amazing or we want to go to a theme park and actually that would be really amazing or they have this hobby. So actually my daughter's into photography, so a camera and accessories and film and all of those things lessons they all cost money actually would much rather your hard-earned money going into something that's going to really help them. Long time, then another thing that it's just gonna take that space and they're not going to play with.
Laura: I think that's so beautiful and so wonderful. I think that's a great place to start. But I also know that there are lots of people who will just disregard that and keep going with what they want to do. That a lot of the parents in my community come to me with that exact thing we've set. We've set compassionate, kind boundaries and they just get disregarded. And I think that that's something that is, it's so important for everybody listening to know that when that is happening, that doesn't mean anything about how that person respects you or how they feel about you.
You can't control how they respond to your boundary or with those types of boundaries. You know, a request for a different sort of gift, or that they stick to like a wishlist or something like you can't control those things. We don't want to be ungrateful. Of course, like you were saying before. You have to look for where you do have control, right?
So we can always control some of those things that they are. If the person in question also has a hard time with boundaries and is having a hard time sticking with the boundary that you're compassionately trying to set, then you have to have, I think, other boundaries in place, like backup boundaries, like, you know, that I don't have to bring this into my house. I also don't have to bring the feelings from this into my heart.
I don't have to bring the feelings into our relationship. I can still have a lovely warm relationship with my mother-in-law with my dad or, you know, with whoever and have a good internal emotional boundary. You know.
Jo: something that we did not so long ago. Somebody talked to me about the love languages. How about that? Amazing. So my dad is who came over from the U K about 40 years ago, came over with very little black really, really hard, and he would always buy a gift. That was how he showed us. He left us. He would always have money or get.
So if we were doing well at school or we had a good report, it was okay, Here's the money. Or let's get you a gift and all he wanted with someone and all I wanted was, I was so proud of you, Um, make some memories and and I really resented the fact that he didn't really have as much time for me and my siblings is what we wanted to do.
And it wasn't like older myself. And I started thinking and self development, and then when I found love languages, I was like, Oh, my God, this makes so much sense And it's not that he wasn't giving me what I needed. He was just showing me, in his own way what he thought I wanted and what he thought it was a token of his life with your amazing because I'm like, I just want you to tell me proud of me. So I think exploring that is really key because we all have different languages would be communicated to in a different way. And just because you want to be communicated or rewarded or firms in one way doesn't mean that the other person knows that or is aware of that and changed that.
So again, those conversations are really key. And I did that with my kids and my husband, and it was a real eye-opener for all of us, which was really, really good. But I feel like you're right. I feel like sometimes I feel like they're not listening to us or they're not respecting us because they're not listening to what I'm saying. And sometimes it's not about that at all. They just they want to show how they are in a certain way.
But I feel like being consistent with your messaging is really, really important. So if you say if they get closed birthdays for Christmas or just on a whim, it's about being consistent with your messaging, planting the seed before. So if it's a birthday is coming up and they're gonna get a bundle full of close, it's actually saying, you know what, So and so he's made a list of what they really want to their birthday. Here's some ideas of what you can get for them. So again you're trynna just give that communication in a really lovely way. I think that's really key to, But again, you can say things really lovely.
But if you feel like you're not being listened to, you can be more done being done. And being assertive doesn't make you a Sometimes you just need to communicate to people in different ways. And my father in law, I mean, he's amazing. He's a great father-in-law, but we are very, very different. And I was very strict with my daughter's routines, and if she didn't eat her dinner in her bed, she wouldn't get putting and and things like that. I remember there was a whole incident at their house once she didn't eat her dinner and I said, Right, there's there's no putting. A little five minutes later, he came and sat down and give her some putting. I just lost my, which I don't recommend for everybody.
You just need to be a little bit more done. And it did cause friction, obviously that night. But I feel like actually there's a bit of a wake up call for him to say. Actually, I need to respect that you are, You are doing things your way. I might not necessarily agree with them, but you're the one that has to remember how, seven days a week, we just for one afternoon, a week or whatever.
So you just have to think about what is more important, getting your message across to the person or not being seen as a certain type of person, because I feel that if we're to assertive, we're gonna leave. The bad taste in people around that makes it a bad person is actually. Sometimes people just need that shock and that reality that I'm not gonna stand for this any longer.
Laura: Yeah
Jo: And put your foot down.
Laura: Absolutely. I definitely think that sometimes it's not wrong to be assertive. I think, too, though we have to take a look at our goals and priorities like we've been talking about earlier and around, like what is more important to us? And is this something that's a deal breaker? Is this something that takes the scales and crosses a firm line for us to the close? It's not something I'm going to go to the mat over with my mother-in-law. I'm not. She's wonderful, generous person, you know.
We feel more fulfilled when she's making like she had makes toys for my kids beautiful. Send more of those. But she enjoys being the close. It's her thing. It's fine, you know. But when it comes to things like forcing affection, which I've had to set pretty firm boundaries with all of my kids grandparents, because it's a different generation, they're not used to it.
But those are things that I am really firm about because I want my girls who grew up knowing that their bodies are theirs and they have full autonomy over the touches that they receive, you know, And so knowing where those lines are for yourself and where the boundaries have to come in and where there are consequences to around like, you know, if you're not able to stop yourself from tickling my daughter when she says No, we won't be able to be around you It's okay to say those hard boundaries.
That's obviously not what you want. I mean, most of us want to have a good relationship with grandparents', but there are lines that and the lines are different for every family. And there are things that you know, When I was younger and younger mom with younger kids, I got worked up over, and now when I look back and like, I should have just let that go, I was not letting them have their own relationship.
You know, like there's some things that just you can just let them things go but really clear on, like what the actual deal breakers are, where the actual line needs to be for your family, and it's okay to take a firm stance on those things.
Jo: I agree 100% is something that I'm very passionate about. I had really six parents like Super Six parents and no, no for them, there was no exploring the reason why you're explanation or any of those. No understanding, no communication. And that was really hard for me growing up because I didn't know the power of pushing back on people. It was the same day, and that's it or consequence because it's a very consequence.
So I, for one, have lived through what you're talking about, that I'm so open with my kids. We talked about everything. We nothing is God. They have such a powerful voice, but I am so proud of because I am not shocked. I don't judge there's anything they say is okay if you're having a bad day and they wanted to tell me to do one like that, it's okay to like kids need the face and the boundaries. Their bodies are so important. And I feel like there are lessons that we need to know, Like someone that really young.
It's about you giving them permission to do that with you clearly are. And it's about standing up for them. When they do, their voices were given them the power to save their grandparents'. That's not okay. I'm not enjoying that. That needs to stop my dad again with the whole time thing. He was again getting my kids present, my kids, but I just wanted to kind of watching football or netball. And why don't you come and see you see that? And he's like, I'm too busy. And then my daughter turned around and said, You're always you always gonna be working. We need to be there for us. We need to make more time, we come and see you. And she was only about eight, I think, and he looked at me and he was like, Oh my goodness, where has come from being really rude.
I'm like, No, she's not being rude. She's being honest. She's getting you need to take it on board because if the child is saying is that is what she wants, that's what she's thinking. I'm not gonna tell her after that. You need to listen and you know what? He listened, and sometimes they just they need to hear from somebody else.
But as long as we can empower our kids to have their own voice and they're going to be so much better than boundaries than we are, Oh my goodness, it's just gonna be hopefully not being able to say no dots that our generation and the kids, they're coming up today and you know the power of their boys and know what's right for them and know what's not right for them. And they're able to voice those and we listen to. I think it's really, really important.
Laura: It's so important and it starts with us, right? This is I mean, this is the whole point of I mean, I guess I get a little tired of hearing that you do this for your kids. I mean, but that's often times what we have to say the moms to get them to take care of themselves, right? Like so, Yes. Do this for your kids. But I also know that this you are deserving of time and boundaries and not being last on the list. Just because you're a freaking person, you're endowed with humanity.
Jo: Yeah, model behavior, right? Yeah. I mean, I have a degree in childhood services. You're clearly very educated yourself in this. So this is the whole nature and nurture thing. Yeah, they see things, a copy, the behavior. They model what they do. So if they see you as a month, you can do whatever you wanna do.
You can go to the moon. You can be the next prime minister or president, and you can say no. And and you don't have to do anything that you don't want to do. And you don't have to be sad because you can put into a situation or you can use your voice and you're saying all these things to your kids. But you're not doing it yourself.
Laura: It's a mixed messages, Really. It's a confusing message for kids.
Jo: Yeah, I can do this, but I'm not doing it.
Laura: Absolutely.
Jo: I'm telling you can achieve this, but I'm not achieving it. It's confusing.
Laura: Yeah.
Jo: They're gonna, they're gonna model. They're going to do what they think.
Laura: Yeah. There's definitely moments of dissonance that make it really challenging for kids to get clear. And I'm blanking on the word that I wanna say it starts with the C.
Can't.
I can't see it. It's okay, I'll have rain. Things that happened, but it really clear and concise. I don't know. I can't think of the word I want to say.
Yeah, but like, not connected but like aligned message a message that is where the message was saying is aligned with our behaviors where they are. You know, you can see that there is alignment between those things. I think it's really important. So, Jo, thank you so much for all of this conversation. I want to make sure that people know where they can find you and follow us. So why don't you tell us where they can, where you live on the internet.
Jo: Thank you so much. I feel like we're going to do today.
Laura: It was good.
Jo: So many different things, but yeah. So I am on Facebook, Jo Bevilacqua, a bit of a mouthful B e v i l a c q u a on Instagram, which I think is where we've been talking a clubhouse room. I love her house. I don't really have that much time for at the moment because I just get so engrossed in it. So Facebook and stuff. I have a website and in my book is on Amazon, or so we've got the paperback and the Kindle versions.
So I really wanna go to read the comments and reach out if any of this has resonated with anybody and yeah, if you start implementing anything or start exercising that muscle and saying no, I want to know about it for sure, I guess so. Pumped when people start putting themselves higher priority list and it starts to pay off.
Laura: So so agree. It's so much fun to hear from focus when something has resonated and you're starting to put it into practice. It's so much fun for sure. Well, thank you so much. It was so fun to get to know you and chat with you all about boundaries today.
Jo: Thank you, see you soon.
Okay, so thanks for listening today. Remember to subscribe to the podcast and if it was helpful, leave me a review that really helps others find the podcast and join us in this really important work of creating a parenthood that we don't have to escape from and creating a childhood for our kids that they don't have to recover from.
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All right. That's it for me today. I hope that you keep taking really good care of your kids and your family and each other and most importantly of yourself. And just to remember, balance is a verb and you're already doing it. You've got this.